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Chaplains Corner A place to discuss religion, personal problems, or to request advise from someone who will listen and provide moral support.

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Old 03-29-2006, 05:59 PM   #1
Zane Zackerly
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Default Tithing vs. Giving: The Straight Poop?

Among members of my family there is a controversy over tithing versus giving.

Tithing, of course, is the requirement to give 10% to the Church or Synagogue.

Some say that tithing was part of the old Jewish law and is no longer a requirement. Everyone agrees, however, that giving is good and you will get back more than you give.

Is tithing obsolete in favor of voluntary giving?

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Old 03-29-2006, 07:45 PM   #2
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I think Tithing is still what you are to do. Where you money is so is your heart.
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Old 03-30-2006, 09:06 AM   #3
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Well Zane, you are correct that the law of tithing is mostly mentioned in the Old Testament, but it is however mentioned in the New Testament. Not as strict as the Old, but it is mentioned.

In the Old Testament it calls a person a thief if you do not tithe.(Malachi 3:8-9). But there is still pretty strong evidence that the Law of Tithes is still in effect in the New Testament. Let's look at Matthew 23:23 where Jesus is talking to the Pharisees.

Matthew 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

Here Jesus is telling them that paying tithes alone is not enough. Yes, they were putting there tithes in the collection plate, but they were living like hypocrites the rest of the week. They were tithing, but ignoring judgement, mercy, and faith. Tithing was the thing they "ought to have done," and the rest were the things they "should not have left undone."

So according to the words of Jesus, the law of tithes was not undone with his coming.

Now for the question of tithing being obsolete in favor of voluntary giving. Well, that's one of those "Yes and No" questions.

I don't believe the law of tithing is obsolete, but at the same time if we grumble or are unhappy when we drop it in the plate, then you are not going to recieve much reward because of your attitude.

I'm going to use Zane as an example of this. His PC crashed and somebody graciously gave him another. Now we don't know who this person is, but I would be willing to bet that Zane would return the favor some how if this persons identity is ever revealed. But if this person told Zane to take this computer and choke on it, then he would probably even think twice about accepting it.

Let's look at 2 Corinthians 9:5-7

2 Corinthinas 9:5-7 [SIZE=1]5[/SIZE] Therefore I thought it necessary to exhort the brethren, that they would go before unto you, and make up beforehand your bounty, whereof ye had notice before, that the same might be ready, as a matter of bounty, and not as of covetousness.[SIZE=1]6[/SIZE] But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully.[SIZE=1]7[/SIZE] Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.

So if you give to the Lord cheerfully, he will return unto you cheerfully. I a m reminded of a joke that I heard once.
Quote:
It was about a man that owned his own business. His income was around $500, so he gladly and faithfully gave his $50 as a tithe to God. God blessed his business and it grew into a multimillion dollar company. The man continued to tithe, but he found that it was a lot harder to be happy about giving $500,000 than it was the $50 he used to give.

So he talked to God one day about reducung his tithe. He explained his case that he was now giving more than he ever did and he felt that it would be OK to reduce his tithing percentage. That he was God all powerful and didn't really need $500,000.

God looked at the man and said would you like me to adjust your income back to were your tithe is only $50 again???
Tithing is about trust. By giving to God that he will give to you. But some churches take it to extremes. I have read of cases where people that had no money to give, that they would give there only pair of shoes in the collection plate. That has never happened to me. But if it did I would either give the person thier shoes back or if they insisted that it was thier gift to God and wouldn't take no for an answer I would hand them some money out of my own pocket and tell them that it was God's return gift to them and go buy a new pair of shoes.

Tithing is more about your attitude and relationship with God. Remember the story of the Widow's Mite(Mark 12:41-44). She didn't even come close to putting in as much money as the rest of the crowd, but she gave all that she had.

There is a difference of giving out of your abundance and giving out of love.

I hope this answered your question. If not I'll be back later in the day.
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Old 03-30-2006, 09:20 AM   #4
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I dont tithe but I do give my church about $2,000 per year......I also have other charities that I give to.
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Old 03-30-2006, 09:26 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DorGunR
I dont tithe but I do give my church about $2,000 per year......I also have other charities that I give to.
I seem to remember a story.......something about giving a cup of water in His name.....and something about if you do it unto the least of these you have done it unto me......

It's all good Sarge. Charity is still giving unto God.
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Old 03-30-2006, 09:33 AM   #6
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If churches actually spent the money on the poor and the needy in a way that was biblical i think i would give more. But it seems that most and i mean most, spend it on projection screens for their sermon theatrical productions, a Huge gym, a school or some other nonsense.

Good stewards i have found few. So easy to spend money when you don't have to earn it. just like the government.

avoid a church with ambition..
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Old 03-30-2006, 10:03 AM   #7
Zane Zackerly
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Good answer, Preach. That's why I started this thread and why I'm glad there's a Chaplain's Corner.

Imagine this forum even surviving somewhere else.

I was saddened recently by a story my boss told me. When he and his family first moved to this area they shopped around for a church to call home.

Now, I should point out that my boss is not rich, but lives pretty well.

He lives well enough that he's often mistaken for a millionaire. We're not talking $100,000 foreign sports cars or anything like that, but he and his wife both generally drive late model SUV's.

Anyway, they had nearly settled on a particular church, when the leaders of that church wanted to have a meeting with him.

The gist of the meeting was, "Could you tell us when you're going to join our church? We REALLY need your money."

Needless to say, he didn't join that church and never went back.
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Old 03-30-2006, 10:05 AM   #8
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Hobbsbk I beleive it takes a comunity to raise a family. I am sorry you view the Schools of churches nonsense. I how ever will do what ever i need to do to give my kids the best education i can. While public schools can do fine (i was raised in one) I think that the Private perocial schools offer a better education for MY children. You may not think that for your children and that is ok for you and you.

The catholic church in ocala, Blessed Trinity has a Great Daycare (Angles in arms) and a good school as well. My older daughter has been in the daycare for over a year now. My youngest daughter starts there in June. My Step son starts kindegarden in the fall there. We regular price for the girls now. But when the boy starts in the school they do 2 different options. As a Church member involved in the stewardship program our kids go to school for free. the catch is to be invloved in the stewardship program you have to do the tithing thing. That is Tax Deductible. If you dont want to do that you pay per kid about 4500 a year. That is not tax deductible in the same fashion. When My older daughter gets to start Kindergarden then the stewardship program does not change but if we did straight tuition it would double. They make it a no brainer to do the Tithing there if you have kids.

The sermon theatrical productions are a part of being able to keep people involved in the church. We are all very multi media oriented these days. Yes there are alot of people that think churches should be minimal but others dont. Many churches use this as a way to introduce new people in to the flock. I am all for churches doing things that raise the awareness of the church in the community. BlessedTrinity has a Fall Carnaval every year. It allows the church to interact with the community in a non religious setting. With all the things this church does it still give helping hands to people when they ask and have programs they support to feed and educate people who are down on their luck.

I am sorry you feel so angry towards the churches, but then again you are an "Angry White Male"
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Old 03-30-2006, 10:08 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zane Zackerly
Anyway, they had nearly settled on a particular church, when the leaders of that church wanted to have a meeting with him.

The gist of the meeting was, "Could you tell us when you're going to join our church? We REALLY need your money."

Needless to say, he didn't join that church and never went back.
I would not be involved in that church either if money is the driving force there. I would have made it a point to write them and let them know why they will not be getting my money and i may even go as far as to find out if they have any affiliation with any other church and send a copy of the letter to them as well to try to help educate them on how not to get members. But some people may think i am an ass for that move.
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Old 03-30-2006, 06:02 PM   #10
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The church I've been attending the last 4 years recently became money-hungry. It isn't because the members don't donate. The problem started when the elders decided, without membership's approval, to add on to the church. An add on? Well, they added on a two-story auditorium building! This church's philosophy is always be debt free, but they had to take out a loan for this huge monstrosity.

I figured I'd stay and see how things worked out. But a few weeks ago, out of the blue and in the middle of his teaching, the pastor goes off on a tangent about tithing and how if every member in the church would tithe just for six months, everyone would see how good it could be, etc. etc....I thought I'd tuned into the Trinity Broadcasting station! My wife and I and many others were utterly shocked as this pastor has never, ever asked for money before, let alone preached a "guilt-trip" type of sermon regarding donating money.

I haven't been back since. I should have known something was up when one of the elders I respected more than any of the others left suddenly, and without a word to the congregation. He just disappeared.
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Old 03-30-2006, 06:13 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanders
But a few weeks ago, out of the blue and in the middle of his teaching, the pastor goes off on a tangent about tithing and how if every member in the church would tithe just for six months, everyone would see how good it could be, etc. etc....I thought I'd tuned into the Trinity Broadcasting station! My wife and I and many others were utterly shocked as this pastor has never, ever asked for money before, let alone preached a "guilt-trip" type of sermon regarding donating money.
The way I look at it if I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing, then I won't have to worry about asking for tithes.
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Old 03-30-2006, 08:38 PM   #12
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Our church used to be missions-oriented, and the missions we supported never wanted for a thing. We had good people who managed the money wisely. Then the food program to feed the poor was dropped, and some missions were recalled.

It's when the leadership decided to become one of those mega-churches that they realized they had to start milking the flock.
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