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Old 08-21-2011, 10:19 PM   #31
Glock AK47son
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[QUOTE=Desert Rat;726628]Speaking of AKs and 30/30s, I don't see either one as a "bad bear" gun. They've got very similar trajectories, i.e. piss poor. Ballistically, the AK is nothing but a 30/30 throwing light bullets. At least with 30/30 you've got the option to get some heavier projectiles.

So unless a brown bear is dumb enough to stand there and let you empty an AK on it........... He's much more likely to charge you at 30 mph and while a shooter is emptying his bowels, he might have time for 3 or 4 snap shots that may or may not hit anything of significance.

Chances are the bear will get to you and shove the AK up your ass.

Everything I've ever read about hunting the big bears of Alaska says the most important thing is to STOP/ANCHOR the bear. A big bullet through a shoulder joint would be nice. If you can do that, then you can kill him almost at your leisure.

Popping a few wimpy bullets at one of these bears is a good way to end up as scat on the forest floor. JMHO[/QUOTE)

I would panic fire the whole mag into him. I use only Wolf SP, that would end his life. I would not trust anything but a semiautomatic in facing a large bear. You won't have time to jack a bolt or a lever for a second shot, IMHO. My default load would be FMJ and here's why: In 1998, Joe Colegrove shot a bear with a SKS four times with HP. It ran away and was heard scraping around all night Wednesday and Thursday.

I went to the shop to pick up my pay packet Friday. I gave Joe thirty rounds of Wolf SP. The following Monday, Joe happily reported that 'one shot of
that there SP' killed the same bear dead. I won't trust trust HP for heavily armored animals like a bear.

Gus doesn't fear bears, he's got lots of 'potato mashers'....
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Old 08-21-2011, 11:08 PM   #32
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It's been truly said that bears only come in two sizes. Big and HUGE.

The big browns of alaska (and Siberia, Kamchatka peninsula) are in the HUGE category.

And the giant Kodiaks (salmon is REALLY healthy food) are darn near in a class by themselves.

Black bears can be brown in color and they're not common but not rare either.

30-30 or similar and up has been good medicine for the blackies for well over a hundred years. Wouldn't hesitate to use the wolf 150 gr SP's on a blackie, little light but it'll get the job done.

Griz is another story, 30-30 or 35 will do it, but placement is important, you don't want to piss him off. Fact is I know of one case where a 38 spcl was adequate. Clearly more power is better and a .338 would be a good choice. The huge bears, the heaviest rifle you can handle adequately.

More armed hunters have been killed by Brown bears than any other land animal on earth. Making them the world's most dangerous game.

First three black bears I ever saw killed were a sow and two cubs (cubs about 90 pounds live, mama was MUCH bigger) were killed with a total of 4 shots from a .22 LR.

Blackies can and do run up to 5-600 pounds and over which is the size of a mountain grizzly.

The thing about Br'r bear is that nothing is where you think it is under that fur coat.

Strongly advise anyone planning a bear hunt to watch one being skinned, or to at least get real studious with some bear anatomy charts. Try what would be a solid heart lung shot for a whitetail, on a bear, and that bear is probably gonna be real irate with you, but he aint gonna fall over dead.

you hear stories about lower power billets bouncing off a bears skull. possible I gues, but when he raises his head to look at you there aint any skull or brain above his eyes.

All that said, blackies are normally merely a PITA, but with the potential to be a threat.

And yes a hungry blackie WILL stalk a child, woman or man of smaller stature with every intention of killing and eating.

All bears are stronger than you can imagine, years ago I watched a 250 pounder (best guess) mosey over to a 50's Chevy, reach out and rip the trunk lid off the car, stick it's head in the trunk and walk away proudly carrying his trophy bag of potato chips. It looked like he used about as much energy as you or I would to open a car door on the up hill side.

Problem bears exist not because "Humans have moved into their ancestral territory." (theme song of the Disney educated bunny huggers).

Problem bears exist because officious and greedy States have increased the cost and limited the hunting that would otherwise control them.

Couple years ago the deer nazis in WI, did some serious counting and discovered the state had at least twice as many bears as they had previously thought.

So much for the wildlife "experts", par for the course.

Humans and bears CAN co-exist if the human keeps a shooting iron handy, but NEVER if that human raises livestock!

Oh yeah! Skinning a bear is very educational also, you'll have to cut every square inch of that hide loose, else it doesn't come off!

Regards,

...
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Old 08-22-2011, 01:29 AM   #33
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When I brought up the 30-30 I was talking black bears here in Colorado. I would much rather carry my Win 94 than any AK you could think of. If the bear is futher north then the rifle would be bigger.
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Old 08-23-2011, 01:30 AM   #34
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Exactly, REW.

Granted there have been all sorts of big animals killed with one shot of the lowliest power rifles. To my thinking it doesn't prove squat. These kills were either a skilled marksman under near ideal conditions or in many cases just blind, staggering luck.

The smart hunter always uses the right tool for the job.

The trouble with "panic firing" is it's usually almost all misses.

Just how big black bears get depends on where they live and what they have to eat. N.M and farther south into Texas, mature bears are much more likely to be in 250 to 350 lb range. (Not that this isn't big enough to rip you a new ass in 5 seconds or less.) The only 600 lb black I've seen or heard of in N.M. is the one living in the Roswell, N.M. zoo. He's 600 and looks every bit of it. But he's a zoo bear and they treat him like royalty. All he does is eat and sleep and grow fat. Doubtless he wouldn't be such a porker if he were out in the wild and had to fend for his lazy self.
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Old 08-23-2011, 04:11 AM   #35
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220 volts.. Best bear weapon made.
Neighbor begged the FWC too relocate the damn bear.
"I will shoot it." $75 fine. Threatening an endangered species.
Broke in his garage, tried or did, get in his house when he was at work.
Wire fence under his garbage containers.
Ran it through his welder somehow.
Sat their till the bear showed up. Put the juice too him.
No Mr. bear was not hurt. But he sure as hell has not been back too those garbage cans.
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Old 08-23-2011, 06:08 PM   #36
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220 volts will get damn near anything's attention.
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Old 08-31-2011, 04:52 AM   #37
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14 years ago we lived in a little town north of Vancouver called Squamish and we lived on the very outskirts of town. We had some problem bears in the area through the summer and DNR came in and trapped a couple, tagged them, and relocated them.

September came and our next door neighbor came running over to tell me that there was a bear in her back yard and could I do something about it. Looked out just as the bear killed her little poodle cross dog. The bear was also being harassed by their collie so he picked up the dead dog and hopped the fence into my yard and proceeded to tear the little dog apart. I had DNR on the phone by this time and they authorized me to shoot the bear within town limits.

I stepped out my back door with a Marlin 444, bear seen me and charged. Stupid me had not loaded one in the chamber so I had to work the lever as I brought the rifle up. Fired one shot that hit the bear right between the shoulder blades severing his spine and busting both shoulders. Bear fell instantly but was still close enough to me that I was able to lean over and poke him with the barrel of the rifle to make sure he was dead.

Local Tribe got some of the meat and I gave them the hide as he was not what I consider a prime pelt. Chief later brought me over a necklace of claws and teeth and said I was allowed to wear it as I had faced the bear and killed him honorably.

Still have the necklace but I took two claws and one tooth off it, to make a smaller necklace and I wear it daily to remind me of my bear. One old Indian I am friends with says that the bear respects me and now travels with me as my guardian. Another Indian friend of mine who is a "medicine man" says the bear is now part of me and there is no way he will even touch the claws or tooth I wear.

Ever cross the border with bear claws and teeth on a necklace ------- Don't know how many times I have been stopped because of it but when I explain they always let me go.

Wasn't my first bear but I imagine it will be my last and I will admit he was a little too close for comfort but man do I love the way a 444 knocks things down.

Dave
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Old 09-03-2011, 05:08 PM   #38
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Almost any rifle caliber that starts with a .4 should be good on a brown bear.

A 12 gauge shotgun with a Brenske or similar slug works too. You may get lucky and kill a bear with an AK. But it certainly wouldn't be my first choice against any bear.
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