.45ACP vs. Con-Law book

Moon · 12-29-2010, 02:58 PM

Well, they obsoleted our Con-Law book at the book-store. For those of you that are not familiar with the great book-store rip-off: You buy your books, most of them are around $140 apiece, then turn around and sell them for around $40. When your book is obsoleted, it instantly becomes worth $6. Well, fuck you, I'm not selling it for $6 !

I took Con-Law a couple of semesters ago, and it was a complete heart-break. My prof was a complete liberal retard, and went on and on about strong federal government, and what a great thing it was. She went on forever about how important 1937 is, because that's when the giant shift from state-government power to strong federal government power occurred (at least according to case-law), and the trend has continued to develop since then. One of my most ashamed days in law school ? Hearing: "Whatever you do, don't actually read the constitution. It's not actually written in English that you and I speak. It means what the Supreme Court says it means." Pissed me off beyond belief.

I talked to another Con-Law prof, and she said: "Well, essentially, your prof is right. The United States may as well not even have a constitution anymore."

That being the case, I might as well do some testing on the text-book. That, and it will allow me to take out my frustrations on the closest representation I can get without being tried for murder. So I put the book in front of a tub full of dirt, setup my chronograph, and fired one shot into the book from about 30 feet. The handgun used was the venerable EAA Witness compact, in .45ACP. The slug was a Hornady 200gr JHP, with a purported velocity of 1055 (according to the box). The chronograph did not register the velocity, I suspect it was just a little too dark outside when I fired the shot. Anyhow, the slug dug in deep, penetrating 969 pages before coming to a stop. For those interested, the slug did not expand. It appears that the cover of the book clogged the hollow point, and essentially created a 200gr FMJ. The jacked peeled a little, and the lead formed a wedge-shape (kind of like a spear-head), but very little expansion. I haven't weighed the slug yet, but it appears to have retained at least 99% of its weight. The pages tore in an H shape, kind of like looking at the end of a piece of I-beam.

Note: I'm well aware that a con-law book does not closely replicate tissue and flesh. This was just a test to see if that particular slug would penetrate 1700 pages of BullShit. This experiment is far from over, as soon as I can find another book, I'm gonna test out a reload or two.

Pogo · 12-29-2010, 03:14 PM

Liberal professors are one of the biggest reasons our country is screwed up.

10 Bears · 12-29-2010, 04:57 PM

Imagine that, a Constitutional Law professor that says "Ignore" the Constitution.

She probably didn't WANT to discuss the term, "Shall Not Be Infringed" either.

How did that mentaly defective, liberal retard BECOME an instructor?

AKWARRIOR · 12-29-2010, 05:10 PM

Liberal professors should be charged with the same crimes that pedophiles are charged with.They are raping children's minds with their anti-American agenda.The scum of society.

xWalt · 12-29-2010, 10:04 PM

1700 pages of Bull Shit, you need to use the 10mm. The college book store scam sucks big time. Can you order them off of Amazon or some other online source to cut them out?

Fj3fury · 12-29-2010, 10:10 PM

Tannerite then a 45...

yyz · 12-30-2010, 12:16 AM

the one that got me was every semester they would change books so yours was worthless or they would buy it back for a nickel on the dollar and sell it used for 90 cents on the dollar. then the classes are not about learning but an ass kissing contest about how well you agree with the idiot who could not make it in the real world.

Desert Rat · 12-30-2010, 04:45 AM

Moon, suggest you go back and try you test once more using 230 gr. RN. Then re-test the 200 gr. HP on your former professor.

I've done a lot of experimenting with various HP pistol bullets and found MOST times one gets zippo effect from the HP. Just not enough velocity to really make it hum.

The exceptions are pistol bullets that are mostly "all hole." They will often expand very well if not too hard. However, anything that can clog up a hollow cavity will.

Rifle bullets are virtually immune to this as their velocity means ANY weakness in the projectile will cause them to come apart or expand in some fashion.

Don't forget the pictures of your X-prof when you do the additional tests. It might be instructive if you would try a shot to the head, chest, guts and one up the ass.

cz7 · 01-20-2011, 12:11 AM

My prof was a complete liberal retard, and went on and on about strong federal government, and what a great thing it was. She went on forever about how important 1937 is, because that's when the giant shift from state-government power to strong federal government power occurred (at least according to case-law), and the trend has continued to develop since then. One of my most ashamed days in law school ? Hearing: "Whatever you do, don't actually read the constitution. It's not actually written in English that you and I speak. It means what the Supreme Court says it means." Pissed me off beyond belief.---hey moon ... i know this one well look up ''lake Erie railroad vs. Tompkins and the outcome was bankruptcy of usa,inc plus case system called the U.C.C. which totally buried the constitution with On April 25, 1938, the Supreme Court overturned the standing precedents of the prior 150 years concerning "COMMON LAW" in the federal government.
THERE IS NO FEDERAL COMMON LAW, AND CONGRESS HAS NO POWER TO DECLARE SUBSTANTIVE RULES OF COMMON LAW applicable IN A STATE, WHETHER they be LOCAL or GENERAL in their nature, be they COMMERCIAL LAW or a part of LAW OF TORTS." (See: ERIE RAILROAD CO. vs. THOMPKINS, 304 U.S. 64, 82 L. Ed. 1188)and Senate Report 93-549 !!

baboon · 01-20-2011, 06:45 AM

Pfft everyone knows, books are to be burned not shot!

ConTender Foot · 01-20-2011, 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10 Bears

How did that mentaly defective, liberal retard BECOME an instructor?

What else was she going to do for a living. The DMV had no job openings.

As for the bullet. I have had essentially the same results from expansion tests on Hornady XTP's out of a 45 ACP. As a matter of fact, a friend of mine used to use XTP sabots in his 50 cal. muzzle loader. He quit when he shot a deer with it and the autopsy showed zero expansion. Essentially a .45 hole in and out. He shot it through the heart so it dropped quickly but he had hoped for a little more tissue damage.

I had good results from my tests using Winchester silver tips. You might give those a try.

Rew · 01-20-2011, 10:22 AM

Your 10mm or 38 super will get through more pages.

Desert Rat · 01-20-2011, 01:07 PM

I've shot some 185 gr XTP in my .41 mag and gotten explosive results. But I know what CTF is saying. A hollow point in pistol is no guarantee of expansion. The bullet MUST be constructed right and you've got to get it running fast enough to destruct.

The 230 gr RN in lowly .45 ACP can be hell of penetrator. One drunken night I sat with my boss in his office sipping whiskey as he played with his new Colt Commander. Suddenly he said, "I wonder if this will go through San Antonio phone book."

As I dove for cover, he fired. To his surprise the bullet went completely through the thick phone book AND the wall behind it...lodging in the opposite wall of his secretary's office.

Luckily she wasn't there.

So it's not a bullet one wants to under estimate.

aviator · 01-20-2011, 02:03 PM

I reckon most politicians have had the same professor at one time or another since most seem to ignore the Constitution.

Desert Rat · 01-20-2011, 10:13 PM

Several current politicians were the professor.

12-29-2010, 02:58 PM	#1
Moon IncogNegro Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 5,825	.45ACP vs. Con-Law book Well, they obsoleted our Con-Law book at the book-store. For those of you that are not familiar with the great book-store rip-off: You buy your books, most of them are around $140 apiece, then turn around and sell them for around $40. When your book is obsoleted, it instantly becomes worth $6. Well, fuck you, I'm not selling it for $6 ! I took Con-Law a couple of semesters ago, and it was a complete heart-break. My prof was a complete liberal retard, and went on and on about strong federal government, and what a great thing it was. She went on forever about how important 1937 is, because that's when the giant shift from state-government power to strong federal government power occurred (at least according to case-law), and the trend has continued to develop since then. One of my most ashamed days in law school ? Hearing: "Whatever you do, don't actually read the constitution. It's not actually written in English that you and I speak. It means what the Supreme Court says it means." Pissed me off beyond belief. I talked to another Con-Law prof, and she said: "Well, essentially, your prof is right. The United States may as well not even have a constitution anymore." That being the case, I might as well do some testing on the text-book. That, and it will allow me to take out my frustrations on the closest representation I can get without being tried for murder. So I put the book in front of a tub full of dirt, setup my chronograph, and fired one shot into the book from about 30 feet. The handgun used was the venerable EAA Witness compact, in .45ACP. The slug was a Hornady 200gr JHP, with a purported velocity of 1055 (according to the box). The chronograph did not register the velocity, I suspect it was just a little too dark outside when I fired the shot. Anyhow, the slug dug in deep, penetrating 969 pages before coming to a stop. For those interested, the slug did not expand. It appears that the cover of the book clogged the hollow point, and essentially created a 200gr FMJ. The jacked peeled a little, and the lead formed a wedge-shape (kind of like a spear-head), but very little expansion. I haven't weighed the slug yet, but it appears to have retained at least 99% of its weight. The pages tore in an H shape, kind of like looking at the end of a piece of I-beam. Note: I'm well aware that a con-law book does not closely replicate tissue and flesh. This was just a test to see if that particular slug would penetrate 1700 pages of BullShit. This experiment is far from over, as soon as I can find another book, I'm gonna test out a reload or two. __________________ "Thou shalt not be a son-of-a-bitch". Magnus392, from Rules of Chuck 00011

12-29-2010, 03:14 PM	#2
Pogo Mystic Knight of the Sea Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: The Great Swamp Posts: 81,978	Liberal professors are one of the biggest reasons our country is screwed up. __________________ .................................................. ....................................… *We have met the enemy, and he is us!*

12-29-2010, 05:10 PM	#4
AKWARRIOR Gone Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Here and Now Posts: 13,454	Liberal professors should be charged with the same crimes that pedophiles are charged with.They are raping children's minds with their anti-American agenda.The scum of society. __________________ WOLVERINES!!! "Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect every one who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined"-Patrick Henry

12-29-2010, 10:10 PM	#6
Fj3fury Non hyphenated American Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: western nc Posts: 3,699	Tannerite then a 45... __________________ Happiness is a mushroom cloud over Mecca

12-30-2010, 12:16 AM	#7
yyz Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: UP of MICH Posts: 1,816	the one that got me was every semester they would change books so yours was worthless or they would buy it back for a nickel on the dollar and sell it used for 90 cents on the dollar. then the classes are not about learning but an ass kissing contest about how well you agree with the idiot who could not make it in the real world. __________________ "if you can't buy off a merc who can you trust?"

12-29-2010, 04:57 PM	#3
10 Bears Moderator Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: E-Da-How Posts: 137,846	Imagine that, a Constitutional Law professor that says "Ignore" the Constitution. She probably didn't WANT to discuss the term, "Shall Not Be Infringed" either. How did that mentaly defective, liberal retard BECOME an instructor?

12-29-2010, 10:04 PM	#5
xWalt Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 875	1700 pages of Bull Shit, you need to use the 10mm. The college book store scam sucks big time. Can you order them off of Amazon or some other online source to cut them out?

12-30-2010, 04:45 AM	#8
Desert Rat Junior Woodchuck Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 4,592	Moon, suggest you go back and try you test once more using 230 gr. RN. Then re-test the 200 gr. HP on your former professor. I've done a lot of experimenting with various HP pistol bullets and found MOST times one gets zippo effect from the HP. Just not enough velocity to really make it hum. The exceptions are pistol bullets that are mostly "all hole." They will often expand very well if not too hard. However, anything that can clog up a hollow cavity will. Rifle bullets are virtually immune to this as their velocity means ANY weakness in the projectile will cause them to come apart or expand in some fashion. Don't forget the pictures of your X-prof when you do the additional tests. It might be instructive if you would try a shot to the head, chest, guts and one up the ass.

01-20-2011, 12:11 AM	#9
cz7 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 3,913	HEY MOON !! My prof was a complete liberal retard, and went on and on about strong federal government, and what a great thing it was. She went on forever about how important 1937 is, because that's when the giant shift from state-government power to strong federal government power occurred (at least according to case-law), and the trend has continued to develop since then. One of my most ashamed days in law school ? Hearing: "Whatever you do, don't actually read the constitution. It's not actually written in English that you and I speak. It means what the Supreme Court says it means." Pissed me off beyond belief.---hey moon ... i know this one well look up ''lake Erie railroad vs. Tompkins and the outcome was bankruptcy of usa,inc plus case system called the U.C.C. which totally buried the constitution with On April 25, 1938, the Supreme Court overturned the standing precedents of the prior 150 years concerning "COMMON LAW" in the federal government. THERE IS NO FEDERAL COMMON LAW, AND CONGRESS HAS NO POWER TO DECLARE SUBSTANTIVE RULES OF COMMON LAW applicable IN A STATE, WHETHER they be LOCAL or GENERAL in their nature, be they COMMERCIAL LAW or a part of LAW OF TORTS." (See: ERIE RAILROAD CO. vs. THOMPKINS, 304 U.S. 64, 82 L. Ed. 1188)and Senate Report 93-549 !! __________________ "It is well that the people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning." -- Henry Ford ! when a nation turns on it's own and denies it's own founding culture ,this is a sign of the death pangs of a nation --- cz7

01-20-2011, 06:45 AM	#10
baboon slug Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Out by the lake in central Texas Posts: 18,318	Pfft everyone knows, books are to be burned not shot!

01-20-2011, 10:22 AM	#12
Rew Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Colorado Posts: 9,710	Your 10mm or 38 super will get through more pages.

01-20-2011, 01:07 PM	#13
Desert Rat Junior Woodchuck Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 4,592	I've shot some 185 gr XTP in my .41 mag and gotten explosive results. But I know what CTF is saying. A hollow point in pistol is no guarantee of expansion. The bullet MUST be constructed right and you've got to get it running fast enough to destruct. The 230 gr RN in lowly .45 ACP can be hell of penetrator. One drunken night I sat with my boss in his office sipping whiskey as he played with his new Colt Commander. Suddenly he said, "I wonder if this will go through San Antonio phone book." As I dove for cover, he fired. To his surprise the bullet went completely through the thick phone book AND the wall behind it...lodging in the opposite wall of his secretary's office. Luckily she wasn't there. So it's not a bullet one wants to under estimate.

01-20-2011, 02:03 PM	#14
aviator unum de multis Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bunker's Headquarters. Posts: 52,437	I reckon most politicians have had the same professor at one time or another since most seem to ignore the Constitution. __________________ "Government is not the solution to our problem, government is the problem." Pesident Ronald Reagan

01-20-2011, 10:13 PM	#15
Desert Rat Junior Woodchuck Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 4,592	Several current politicians were the professor.